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Astro-Databank: Vladimir Putin (Read 1405 times)
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Astro-Databank: Vladimir Putin
« on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
Discussion about
Vladimir Putin, born 7 October 1952 at 09:30 AM in St. Petersburg
 
This discussion is imported from the  comment board on the  previous astrodatabank.com website.

Many times the chart of a leader will set the tone for the entire country.
  • What can we learn about Russia's future for the next four years from his chart?
  • Astrologically speaking, what makes him such a popular leader?
  • What is it about this chart that screams spy?
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #1 - on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Matthew Quellas
 
Lois & Everybody,  
Here's the most recent e-mail I have from Stef de Groot. It should clarify some points.
Dear Mr Quellas,  
I was glad to see that you used my data on Putin as your main source of information. There are several things that obviously need some more explanation:  
First of all, the data wasn't from his birth certificate (that was a slip of the tongue, for I didn't study the document thoroughly enough), but from a medical report made right after birth. (Putin's mother was in her 40s when she delivered him, therefore a thorough check-up was needed.) I received this information (a copy made of a copy) from a friend, who is doctor in St Petersburg.  
It is true that my website is hosted by Geocities (I'm a student who is abroad all the time, so Geocities is a sensible choice), my name isn't Russian (my father is from Holland) and I'm not a Kremlin-official.  
I truly hope that you now are able to defend that you're using me as main source of information. http://vladimirputin.4u.ru/  
Yours kindly,  Stef de Groot,  webmaster of the Inofficial / Critical / Independent Vladimir V. Putin website http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Parliament/5160/Putin/ http://vladimirputin.4u.ru/
 
While this might not be "AA" data, I would guess that it's as close as we can get. Use it or not as you choose. The Internet is a tremendous resource for us as astrologers. I've learned that it never hurts to look or to ask. I've also learned to question the source as closely as possible and then to say a heart-felt "thank you" for what I've been given.  
With Putin's Sun and Moon both tied to his Saturn-Uranus square, and considering that he was elected and inaugurated under a Saturn-Uranus square of the same phase type, we might consider him to be a manifestation of the current Russian Zeitgeist. Compare his chart to the chart of when the Soviet flag was lowered (Dec. 25, 1991 @17:32 UT). Check that chart's Q1 quotidians and Solar Return quotidians as well as Putin's. You might be surprised at what you see.
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #2 - on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Valerie Barnes
 
Hi Everyone:  
Russia's future with Putin at the wheel - Well, he has Sun quincunx Sat. which shows he is a determined guy, but as the quincunx is an ongoing aspect, it remains to be seen if he can handle the power he now has. The Jupiter/Pluto square shows he may never be satisfied with the power he may acquire. Please let me say this: I firmly believe that there are no BAD aspects in a natal chart. The hard aspects are merely pointed lessons that the native must be exposed to and learn from via his/her own free will. Usually aspects such as quintiles and biquintiles are viewed as minor aspects by most of us. But in the case of Putin, the geometry (triangle, with Jup. at point) clearly shows his self expression and self stimulus. Jupiter (expansion, good fortune) quintile Sun (the native) biquintile Mars (sports, which he is known for, and aggression and war, as in the case of Chechnya), which in turn quintiles Jup. A person (Sun) who expresses themselves in sports, adventure, and also the unfortunate side of Mars, war, and whose good at it (Jupiter). I'm sure that the Russian people see him as a person (Sun) of action (Mars), who is not afraid to go forward (Jup.) and get things done. Of course, the path that he will take depends on his own interpretation of his destiny, as paradox is always present in everything we human animals do. The Russian people are down and almost out, as was Germany prior to WW 2. Even though he is not a "Charismatic" speaker, as per Hitler or Huey Long, action generally speaks louder than words, and Putin is a person of action, so I reckon we'll have to just wait and see which road he'll take. With Pluto in the 10th, con. MC., in Leo, he is dealing with the "dark side of the performer", as his work goes. I hope he senses this. As for the spy thing, the fore mentioned Pluto in 10th suggests his "work" is dealing with things that are hidden or behind the doors marked "do not enter". The Scorpio AC, as per trad. astrology, is the detective (or spy). And since Pluto is ruler (or at least co-ruler) of Scorpio. One more odd thing I must comment on: By secondary progression, Putin's Sun progressed to his natal AC when he was 19 or 20yrs old. I haven't calculated the time exactly, but this is the time frame. John McCain and Geo. Bush both have this aspect as does Bill Clinton. Trad. astrology says that this aspect bestows either fame or infamy on the native, and will have a large impact on him/her for the duration of life. McCain's time came (if his birth time is correct) at about the time he got involved with his first wife, and we know how that turned out for him. Clinton's came about the time he gained reelection as Gov. of Ark.. Bush, at the time he was learning to fly jet fighters and stay out of Vietnam. I have been doing research on this morning aspect, but my thoughts are far from complete on the subject as it seems to be completely esoteric, but I feel it warrants further investigation. Last, but a universe away from being least, is Putin's aspects in the declinations, where he is very strong. His Sun parallel Saturn, like his Sun/Sat. quincunx, shows great determination. Venus parallel Chiron shows an ease (Venus) to his destiny (Chiron). Venus contra parallel Jup. is a tremendous aspect as it gives him the ability to be a born leader and take command. This also indicates a champion in sports, as is self evident in his Bio. Jup. contra parallel Chiron lends itself to a fabulous (Jup.) public image (Chiron). It instills trust and foretells of a great destiny. Link this to the Ven./Chiron aspect and it becomes supercharged. The Uranus/Pluto parallel shows that transformation (Pluto) to the masses (Uranus) is also on the agenda. All of this, with Mars in the 2nd (possessions) in Sag. (higher thought, philosophies) show what he is ready to fight for. Let's just hope that his philosophy and higher thought coincide with peace on our little planet.
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #3 - on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User "R.J."
 
This is a question for Ms. Valerie Barnes: Ms. Barnes (without sounding disrespectful) you seem like an "experienced" astrologer," but you need to work on your "basics." In your commentary, you mentioned (twice) that Vladimir Putin's known birth chart (Oct. 7, 1952, 9:30 am) has Sun "quincunx" Saturn (or 150 deg. away). However, his natal Sun is 13 deg. Libra 56", while natal Saturn is 17 deg. Libra 27". This would make it a "conjunction" (between Sun and Saturn) and not a "quincunx," would it not ?
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #4 - on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User "R.J."
 
Regarding Vladimir Putin and his relationship with the United States, I think that Americans (in general) have some justification to fear (and/or) mistrust Putin, as there are aspects that indicate his relationship with the U.S. may indeed become unstable and/or "difficult" (or he may be perceived as unstable or difficult, from the American point of view).  
It's worthy to compare the close aspects between Uranus, Pluto and the lights (Sun and Moon) in the natal chart of Putin and the U.S.A. constitution chart (you can pick Gemini or Scorpio rising; it doesn't matter)  
1. USA natal Sun in Cancer conjunct Putin's natal Uranus. Putin's natal Moon in Gemini conjunct USA's natal Uranus. (For reasons of space, I'll concentrate on the Sun/Uranus aspect)  
Comments: These aspects suggest an underlying tension in the relationship. I have seen some books that say that a relationship is not likely to be "permanent" under a Sun/Uranus contact. Of course, in politics, nobody is going to hold power, forever. What this aspect indicates then, is if the relationship does "last," then expect unforeseen developments and events, whereby the nature and original purpose of the relationship is revised or drastically altered in some way.  
I believe the Unites States (symbolized by the Sun) is going to be frustrated by Putin (Uranus) and tendency to bend the rules to suit his own needs as well as a general lack of cooperation. At the same time, a full-scale "war" between the United States and Russia during Putin's time is probably unlikely to happen. That's because the U.S.A.'s natal Mars (i.e. "America's armed forces capabilities") is friendly to Putin's Chart and makes few harsh aspects. Putin's natal Mars in Sagittarius is also well aspected in his own chart. His Mars makes "friendly" aspects between Mercury, Mars and Pluto. That indicates that Putin enjoys (or will come to enjoy) a fairly good relationship with the Russian Military and its' top Generals. These aspects could also mean the beleaguered Russian Army will be given an overhaul under Putin's reign and Russia's overall military resources will be strengthened and its' moral will be improved.  
Another interesting commentary of an Uranus/Sun aspect is: the person who has Uranus conjoining the Sun of the other person often sees the "Sun" person as an "equal," regardless of the Sun person's station in life. What is happening is that the Sun person is unconsciously bring to "light" the Uranian qualities of the other party. In a true URANIAN world, one see everybody as "equals" and all subordinates and "slaves" must be released.  
Although the United States is widely viewed as the most prominent economic and military power on the planet, it is possible that Putin (over time) may come to view the United States not just as a superpower and a rival, but as an "equal" and this mentality can lead to a lot of trouble down the road, particularly if Putin can persuade the Russian masses into his line of reasoning (and which he is certainly capable of pulling off.)
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #5 - on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Dorothy J. Kovac
 
Dear Lois,  
The following letter comes from Anton Grigoriev, a prominent Russian astrologer, who I have been lucky enough to be in contact with for the past few months. I had expressed my skepticism about the time given on your site for Putin's time of birth. Below is his response.  
I think you may be absolutely skeptical about it. Because here are no birth certificates in American or European meaning of this word. We have birth certificates as a kind of child's passports, but a birth time is not indicated therein. Ordinarily in Russian maternity hospitals doctor bind a small piece of paper to a newborn child's hand (just for identification), and on that paper, commonly, birth time is noted. Sometimes mothers are keeping that paper as a kind of family relic. So, that webmaster could ask Putin or his mother, but it seems to me very doubtful, it's too cool for webmaster. Besides, the birth time is being noted in a hospitals registration book, but that book is kept only during 25 years and then must be destroyed. I think it was just a kind of webmaster's joke. Poor modern astrologers! 'Rodden Rating: A' (as I have understood it means 'very reliable')! I am foretasting their scientific analysis!  
Rodden: 'Astrologically speaking, what makes him such a popular leader?' Diehard: 'Astrologically speaking, another nativity makes him such a popular leader.'  
Sorry, it's my Jupiter on MC in Scorpio.  
All the best, Anton Grigoriev  http://www.people.nnov.ru/astrology
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #6 - on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Alan J. Ouimet
 
Having been an F.B.I. Agent for over 25 years assigned to foreign counterintelligence I have no problems with his chart - it resembles my own and many of my former F.B.I. confreres. He has a Scorpio Asc with Pl in 10 - I had a Cancer Ascend with Plin 1 and Mars in Scorpio sqr Sun in 8th. Working a job such as KGB and FBI - the Scorpio, as investigator, is important Putin had Pluto sxt Mercury; I have Pluto oppose Mercury; he has Sa conj Ne; I have Saturn opp Neptune. His Mars (with exception to Pl) is unaspected - I have Mars in Scorpio Sqr Sun with Aries ruling MC. He has a Venus unaspected in Scorpio (ruled by Mars) I have an unaspected Venus in Aries. He has Moon in the 8th House - I have Sun in the 8th House.  
The chart shows a high level of secrecy and member- ship in a secret community with Su-Sa-Ne-Me in Libra in the 12th house - absolutely ideal as an astro-logical signature for the KGB. Further it is squared by Ur in Cancer - intense nationalism. The Scorpio Ascendent with Pl on Mc sqr Ju IS the fullness of power.  
And his battles? 7th House - Ju Taurus is inconjunct the 12th House stellium - expansion of business - capitalism. Is he a reformer? Yes - Uranus in the 9th house sqr the signature of the KGB in 12th house has him as ruler over a reformed KGB - it is no longer called that.  
He is a popular leader because of his intense nationalism - Ur Cancer - especially in 9th House foreign relations.  
What screams spy? Look at my first paragraph. He was one - guys like me were chasing him - the other side of the same coin.
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #7 - on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User
 
Venus in the first house makes one very popular and attractive to others. The spy qualities I see in the 12th house stellium containing the sun, neptune, mercury being conjunct.
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #8 - on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Kevin Bold
 
That triple conjunction of Pluto, Midheaven, and the Moon's South Node looks a bit scary. Transformation is a major theme in Vladimir Putin.  
Having Jupiter as the focal point of a T-Square may make him optimistic, but Jupiter may also make him excessive.  
Saturn and Uranus are form an odd combination, Uranus being Prozac to Saturn's capacity to induce depression.  
Mercury conjunct Neptune: Putin may appeal to collective fantasies, and dark ones at that. I'm not sure I'd want to live in a country this man ran.
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #9 - on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Atossa
 
Anyone interested in the mystical aspects of President Vladimir Putin's rise to power in Russia, please visit my homepage: http://www.geocities.com/rusatossa
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #10 - on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Lilian Nirupa Penna
 
I believe in the 1.00 a.m. version. In Vedic Astrology, it gives him a Cancer rising with the ruling planet exalted in the 11th, (wish fulfilling house). Jupiter rules the 9th in the house of career. The 5th of May 2000 stellium fell on his house of career with extraordinary power.
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #11 - on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Joseph James
 
The Russian submarine tragedy that has attracted worldwide attention of late provides yet another event that confirms Putin's rectified ascendant at 14 Leo: note that near the beginning of media coverage of this event last week, the midpoint of transiting Mars, ruler of Putin's natal cusp 10, and Putin's natal Mars was opposite his natal Placidus cusp 10, using the 14 Leo ascendant. This is a very weighty top-tier canonic relation that tags fine with his sudden loss of popularity and public standing among the Russian people, who blame him for mishandling this crisis. And newspapers reported that Putin was threatened with unspecified retribution by an unidentified woman on August 22, 2000, just as transiting Mars applied conjunction to his rectified ascendant at 14 Leo with one degree of orb.  
To me, these Mars transits provide further, and ample, confirmation of Putin's 14 Leo ascendant. In a previous post, I said that I would not post further regarding Putin's rectification, having satisfied myself that the 14 Leo ascendant is a true radix; however, these Mars transits to Putin's chart are difficult to ignore, and so I've chosen to comment upon them here.
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #12 - on: 07.05.2002 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Atossa
 
' His Sign ' ?!  
A five planet alignment which occurred during Vladimir Putin's inauguration on 5-7-2000 is again present for his second anniversary !!  
http://www.geocities.com/rusatossa
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #13 - on: 24.04.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User David West
 
Uranus trine his Saturn, Neptune, and Mercury and conj. his North Node has seen his incredible rise to power. What you see is not what you get as the Libran conj. is all in his 12th house. The next four years will go very well for him. The movement of Uranus, Neptune, Pluto, Saturn and Jupiter are all in his favour. He will outlast his critics and go on to win the Presidency again.
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #14 - on: 14.03.2001 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User amy maddalozzo
 
Well, he's got pluto conjunct his MC. He also has saturn-neptune-mercury conjunct in his 12th house. That, for me, screams spy. pluto conjunct the MC makes him popular with the masses.
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #15 - on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Jan Westerveld
 
I immediately considered the official birth time unbelievable: with mercury and venus near the ascendant I would expect a much more communicative, or socially gregarious personality. Trying 01:00 am gives an angular saturn (IC) midpointing sun and neptune/mercury: a much more powerful arrangement. Indicative of the ruthless determination to have things his way as well as his cunning and secrecy.
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #16 - on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Albert R. Timashev
 
How could you rate AA the data received from unknown person - someone "Stef de Groot", the "webmaster" of the "site" actually hosted at Geocities: http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/Parliament/5160/Putin/. This is nonsense! He has obviously NOTHING to do with Vladimir Putin. Please, tell us, why do you trust this man? And are there any reasons for this trust, or only desire to find the "trustworthy" birth time by any means?
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #17 - on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Lana (former Soviet Citizen)
 
For many reasons it is hard for me to believe that we can get AA data for Mr. Putin. For one, Soviets never recorded time on birth certificate. Did someone saw his hospital records? That would be very difficult to do, because these are not public records. In my opinion this chart suits Putin. Four planets in Libra including Sun, Venus in the 1st house big plus for popularity, loaded 12th house and Scorpio Asc great for diplomat and a spy. But I am skeptical, and I would test this chart for at least a year, before making any official predictions. Only time will show us how accurate this chart is. I am still convinced that with 'Master Spy' like Putin, we can only see what he wants us to see.
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #18 - on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Adrian Ross Duncan
 
I'm not sure that the chart actually "screams" spy - though with Scorpio rising and Pluto/South Node conjoining the MC and trining Mars, this is clearly the chart of a powerful and secretive person. And one could imagine the Moon in Gemini on the cusp of the 8th as being pretty good at information-gathering. And the 12th House stellium is kind of invisible... OK, OK it's spy. The man should be arrested.  
It's interesting to see that he was born just before Stalin died, and has the Saturn/Neptune signature that is so relevant for the evolution of communism. He probably really wants to serve the Russian people. Fascinating too, that he becomes president as the outgoing Saturn/Uranus square from his birth repeats for the first time. Obviously he embodies the energies of this square, which is has so much to do with the stresses between the old and the new. His election would also seem to confirm the good fortune of the Jupiter return. This is a chart strangely devoid of any good aspects (apart from Mercury configuring with the Mars/Pluto trine ... which is not exactly heaven).
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re: Vladimir Putin
« Reply #19 - on: 21.04.2000 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Margaret Almazova
 
Hello, Lois !  
May be I am wrong, but the source of the "accurate data" looks suspiciously, but not as AA. I have read that the source is "AstroDatabank.com subscriber Matthew Quellas, who contacted the webmaster of a Vladimir Putin web site" and this Stef de Groot, webmaster's, words: "The time of birth was from his official Soviet birth certificate, as you inquired." The site mentioned: http://vladimirputin.4u.ru/  
1. The origin of the site itself is unknown (it's not the official site and it exist only in English)  
2. Webmaster Stef de Groot (name in Russia !) knows Putin's birth certificate (webmaster !!) and gives the data from it freely to some Matth.Quellas !!!  
3. In these years almost any of us haven't any birth certificate with time at all (although may be some exceptions are possible) - a tradition to record time not existed. It's my town and my years.  
4. Don't remember about KGB. May be you know more about the source?  
With all my warmth, Rita from St-Peterburg
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25-Apr-2014, 02:25 UT/GMT
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